Difference Between Orthodox and Catholic
Orthodox vs Catholic
The doctrines of Orthodoxy and Roman Catholicism have been separated for over a thousand years. In an attempt to differentiate between Catholicism and Orthodoxy, many, especially from the Orthodoxy doctrine, have used the terms Pope, filloque or even Purgatory, to show the diversion between the two. However, there are many differences, and most are significant.
To explain the concept of Faith in Orthodoxy, science and philosophy are used. The Catholic Church puts a lot of value on human reason, as if to make it consistent with human reason and science. The Orthodox Church, on the other hand, does not seek to make human reason and faith reconcile, but will support the findings of science or philosophy if they shed light, or lend support, to Christ’s teachings.
Catholic doctrine believes in the theory of doctrinal development, where the belief is that Christ’s teachings changes with the times. The church believes that Christ only ‘planted’ an original seed of faith, that then grew and matured with the centuries. As the church encountered new situations, the Christian faith was made stronger by the Holy Spirit and, therefore, more needs were acquired. Although Orthodoxy acknowledges changes, it will not add or subtract from its Faith to accommodate ‘acquired needs’ that come with change.
With regards to proving the existence of God and His divine being, Orthodoxy teaches that God’s knowledge is planted in human nature, and that is how humans know that He exists. Human reason can never tell more than that, unless God speaks to the human. This hugely contrasts with the catholic teachings of God, which state that the eternal existence of the Almighty can be proved by human reason. Roman Catholics believe that God is the ‘most real being’, and that humans have a likeness to Him, except that we are imperfect.
Regarding mysteries, both doctrines recognize at least seven sacraments, including Chrismation, Penance, Ordination, Marriage, Baptism, the Eucharist and the Holy oil for healing. Although, in general, Orthodoxy teaches that the material becomes filled with grace by calling the Holy Spirit. For the Catholics, they believe that the efficacy of the sacraments lies with the priest, that acts ‘in the person of Christ’. In addition, the catholic’s interpretation of the sacraments is legal and philosophical.
Concerning marriage, Orthodoxy’s holy matrimony is not a binding contract like in Catholicism. The Orthodox take holy matrimony as some imitation of the bond between the church and Christ, witnessed by all ‘God’s people’ through the presbyter. Although divorce is not allowed, it is permissible in adulterous cases. The Catholics do not permit divorce under any circumstance, as the holy matrimonial contract ostensibly binds the man and woman to the church. Only if some canonical defect is found therein, may it be rendered null and void, as if it never happened.
Summary
1. Catholicism employs human reason in explaining the concept of faith, while Orthodoxy doesn’t reconcile human reason with faith.
2. The Catholic doctrine evolves with change in time, and needs to fit in with prevailing circumstances, while Orthodoxy does not change it’s doctrine to fit with situational needs.
3. In holy matrimony, for Catholics, divorce is not permitted under any circumstances, while for Orthodox, it may be permitted when adultery is committed.
4. Catholics believe that human reason can prove the existence of God, while the Orthodox believe that God’s knowledge is planted in human nature.
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I am Catholic, and I respectfully must say that I have never heard the principle of Christ’s “teachings” changing over time. While it is true that the Church grew like a mustard seed into a great tree, the Roman Church, as far as I know, believes and teaches that the Apostolic Deposit is essentially unchanged and unchangeable. The popes and councils can not add or take away, but they can clarify. I don’t think even Cardinal Newman would disagree on that point. Sometimes I think that good folks actually believe that all doctrine emerged fully formed at Pentecost.
The “efficacy” of the sacraments also does not depend on the priest alone; if this were so a bad priest might not be able to confect a valid mass. I admit that Aquinas and so forth taught much about reason being important in Catholic tradition, but this entry fails to recognize other streams of thinking. This entry sounds to me like it was written by an ex-Catholic or a convert to Orthodoxy, perhaps even a former evangelical Protestant, who has attempted to crystallize in his mind certain distinctions in order to reject Catholic jurisdictional claims, while attributing to Orthodoxy, on the one hand, the unchangeable truth that it does teach but also, on the other hand, an attitude, which, though I admit is more palatable to the mindset created by our culture, is not necessarily solely Orthodox.
Dear Brothers and Sisters
I have a request for you all. you are all like our brothers and sisters. We should all think about the future life. The life after death, when the soul would be taken out of our bodies. The life after death could be either good or bad. We could not think about what was right or what was wrong after death. After death we could not get the chance to correct ourselves. Therefore, we should not take risk of life after death but we should do the true research about the GOD. The God is the One Who is the Master of this Universe not only the earth and man. He can not have the son neither He could be father of any one. Think if He was once on Earth then at that time Who was operating the universe. We should atleast believe in our heart that there is none like God but He is the Master of this Universe. We should do some research, read the Devine Books like true Bible or Quran in our languages. The information in these Books about the universe and galaxies that was given more than 1400 years ago is not fully proved by science till now. Think, Who could give that information at that time. This is the time to think as we are still alive.
Regards
Sumair
The immaculate conception is a novel doctrine invented by Rome for its own reasons. The historical record is clear that the RC church changes, while Orthodoxy stays the same. Any outside observer can tell you that. If you prefer a church that changes things, be catholic.
I am also a Catholic, and I agree with you on this post’s explanation on how Catholicism supposedly changes. We need to distinguish between doctrine and discipline. Doctrine cannot change in the sense that we once believed one thing that we no longer do. The church could never deny the assumption of Mary or trans-substantiation. It is true that the pope only recently pronounced the assumption to be doctrine, but this teaching was embrionic in Scripture. Papal pronouncements like this represent an unfolding of Christ’s teaching, not a change from one belief to another. A discipline, in contrast, can change so we no longer do something we once did. In the U.S., for example, we can now eat meat on all non-lenton Fridays if we substitute another form of penence. To summarize, disciplines can change over time, whereas doctrine must be discovered.
GOD IS AND WILL ALWAYS BE GOD HE WORKS AT HIS PACE AND IF HE THINKS PEOPLE HERE ON THIS PLANET CAN DO BETTER THEN WHAT THEY ARE NOW HE WILL SETFOURTH A MESSENGER OF GODS WORD AND WE NEED TO TAKE IN EVERY WORD THAT WAS AND IS BEING SAID WE ALL NEED TO GIVE HIM OUR FAITH AND BELIEF BECAUSE GOD IS REAL DEMONS ARE REAL HEAVEN AND HELL ARE REAL EVERYONE NEEDS TO GIVE FAITH AND THERE BELIEF WHOEVER DOES SO WILL BE SAVED AND BLESS FOR ALL ENTERNITY BWFORE AND AFTER DEATH… THANK YOU GOD FOR BEING IN MY LIFE IM SORRY THE WORLD HAS FALLEN INTO ALL FALSE PROPHECIES. THERE IS ONLY 1 TRUE PROPHET AND IT IS Jesus Christ HIMSELF HE WILL SPEAK OUT WITH A STRONG AND STURDY VOICE AND I GIVE PIETY AND MERCY ON THE PEOPLE WHO DONT LISTEN AMEN
Why “respectfully”, it simply proves that this article is very bad, biased and uninformed (this site has good articles, but articles about religions are not the greatest one, some are really uninformed!).
If the site was serious, it would review articles by specialists. Some articles look like a student used Wikipedia to compare things.
I definitely agree with you Peter, follow the Catholic Church, the ONLY True Church of God. Do not judge the faith that you know nothing about. Take the time, do some real research using Catholic resources, you will find that Catholic teachings does NOT contradict the bible in any way and is perfect in “every” way.
With infallible scripture, there must be an infallible interpreter. That infallible interpreter is the Catholic Church through the power of the holy Spirit (The Spirit of Truth).
Umm… while it may be hard for some to accept… Nothing on this earth is perfect in every way. Only God knows what church, if one exists, is the True Church Of God. All Biblical teachings contradict the Bible, because the Bible contradicts the Bible. I’m a very religious person, and strong in my faith, but nothing that comes from human mind or tongue is perfect or infallible. Only God Himself is perfect. Only God infallible. Period. “Only a fool would claim to know any god’s will.” it’s a good quote to memorize, reminds us of our fallibility. Reminds us that no matter what our interpretation of a scripture may be, we have to understand that we may be wrong, and that all we can do is accept that, and hope He shows us what is right. And if still we don’t see it, then one day, when we meet Him, He will show us then. 🙂
Great blog, not sure how accurate, I’ll have to do some other research on it, it did seem a bit biased towards Orthodoxy, but still a good article. 🙂
If i may correct you. Catholicism is the True Church of God. It is in the bible, when Jesus said to Peter “upon this rock i shall build my church… what ever you loose on earth shall be loosed in Heaven.” Meaning that anything Peter and his successors* say and do becomes LAW not only here on earth but in Heaven. Through this ALL canonically elected** Popes are given “Papal Infallibility” by God, meaning that they are so full of the Holy Spirit that they will not make a mistake, and that we MUST follow them and the Church. Though i do agree with you that the rest of us are perfectly fallible and WILL make mistakes. Also your quote “Only a fool would claim to know any god’s will,” very nice.
Foot notes:
*the successors being the Popes.
** Canonically elected refers to Popes elected by the clergy, through history some monarchs took it unto themselves to bestow Papacy to unworthy people. Example: Pope Alexander XI, a member of the Borgia Family. However, Papal infallibility still stand and anything he and others enacted is official. This is also how we get Antipopes: Popes not considered real Popes because they were put into reign, by a monarch, at the same time of a Canonical Election.
Now since the Catholic church split itself from the original church (that is the Orthodox church as known today) it can only mean that the Catholic church cannot be the True Church and cannot claim to be the True Church.
I am not a religious person but I believe that if there is a God there is not a single way or a religion or a church to glorify God. As the human have many races and faces (God himself has many faces – at least according to the Bible), there cannot be a single true religion and church.
Such claims are anti-God.
The Orthodox church rejected the Catholic Church, especially as the Catholic Church was formally defining its stance on Papal authority, which had existed in tradition back through the entire history of the Church.
Regarding no “True Church”… Christian doctrine disagrees… “I am THE way, THE truth and THE life.” There are certainly right and wrong philosophies.
Regarding orthodoxy and the original church….
The Catholic Church did not split from the Orthodox Church. It was the other way around. The Orthodox Church rejected long established Papal authority in determining matters of faith, especially in supporting a 4 century old doctrine (documented at the Third Council of Toledo) regarding the Holy Spirit and Christ (filioque) that had also been espoused by Church Fathers centuries before (Tertullian, Ambrose, Augustine, Jerome).
Umm, actually it’s the other way around. Orthodox church was the one who separated from the original church, the Roman Catholic.
Orthodox is the true and closest religion to God. Even the word Orthodox = the right way.
why do u want to jugde others?
“Papal Infallibility” by God, meaning that they are so full of the Holy Spirit that they will not make a mistake, and that we MUST follow them.
Seems to me, the protection of those naughty child molesting priests given by the so called “Papal Infallibility Crew” picks, (excuse the pun) “wee holes” in your quest for a heavenly oasis.
Good luck to all on their path to God. But to show hate towards any of gods children “no matter their belief” shows that none of us are perfect for the land of milk & honey. Not fussed on either, but if there’s nout else about, i’ll give it a go.
I love your respond, so agree .
There IS a true church of God. The Roman Catholic church is the only church that can trace its history all the way back to Jesus Christ, when Jesus said to Peter, “Upon this rock, I shall build my church and not even death can destroy it.” Saint Peter was the first pope. And death in the verse actually talks about the sinful ways of some priests nowadays. It talks about spiritual death, not death literally. All the other Christian religions nowadays just sprang up way after Jesus Christ.
I agree with you in full and I know you know what you are actually talking about
While you believe in the Catholic Cult, I have been robbed by catholics and lied to ,and they still owe me money. So its back to the same storey do not trust who preaches they are better at relgion . WE ARE ALL CHRISTIANS ?
Hi, my dear
What i want to say is that nobody is pecfect except our LORD and GOD. That is why HE say love those who hate and your will receive more blessings.
Agreed John. It’s easier for the RC religion to onto others that you would never do onto anyone. Forgive me father for I have sinned: says the sinner. Nay bother young sinner, your forgiven. After all, I’m not such an angel myself. sayeth the priest. If this crew gets to heaven? It’s a place I want to avoid. Child abuse covered up and thieving simply forgiven.
Actually there are many ways the Catholic church contradicts the bible. For one the original and only way to make true communion is through the use of specially made holy bread called prosforo. It is flat out wrong to use a wafer for communion and in addition the catholics worry about hygeine when recieving holy communion. Are you kidding me? It is the body and blood of our lord and savior Jesus Christ! How can your “faultless” leader the pope accuse the body and blood of christ to have any contamination in it.
Im not saying that i hate the catholic church, honestly any way to get people to believe in christ is beautiful, but by changing what was originally set up by the very same people who knew christ just because “gods bffl” said to makes many of the teachings of catholics invalid and just flat out wrong. And i hope that one day the churchs will merge and become one once again.
The ONLY true Church of Christ?… that is setting judgement and the Bible sttes not to judge. None are better than another- it’s being Faithful and obedient to God that matters!
You wrote, “Catholic doctrine believes in the theory of doctrinal development, where the belief is that Christ’s teachings changes with the times.” This statement is false. In the interest of truth I humbly request that you either provide proof of your assertion from the Catechism of the Catholic Church (or other source of similar authority) or that you remove this false statement.
What the (Roman) Catholic Church does believe is that Christ’s teachings, though “once and for all,” need to be applied to an ever-changing and evolving world. This does not mean that Christ’s teachings change, but that it requires intelligence and reflection to adapt them to new situations that did not exist at the time of Christ and the apostles.
Further, it includes the (correct) recognition that we come to understand things more deeply over time, both individually and collectively as the Body of Christ. In this way, the Church or individuals may have insights or see meaning in a teaching from Christ or the apostles that might not have been readily-evident at the time and in the context of its original presentation.
However, these new applications and insights may never contradict the plain truth of the doctrine, itself.
You wrote, “Roman Catholics believe that God is the ‘most real being’, and that humans have a likeness to Him, except that we are imperfect.” You seem to believe that this is a distinction from Orthodox belief. Catholics (and most Christians) believe that we are created “in the image of God,” as we are taught from the Scriptures, but that we also all have sinned and so “fall short of the glory of God.” If Orthodox Christians do not believe the same, then I don’t think that the error is on the Catholic side here.
There is more, but it is probably best that I leave it at this. In any event, it is fine to point out differences, but better to do so in a way that does not misrepresent the other’s point of view.
If you have further questions about what the Catholic Church actually teaches and why, please feel free to contact me.
You are correct. The Catholic Church has an old mantra which it has always used in defining its theology. “Truth cannot contradict truth.” While truth can develop in depth and expand in understanding, what was before an absolute truth, remains today and forever an absolute truth.
Actually the bit about Catholics believing that God is a “most real being” is misleading. Catholics believe that God is a pure and spiritual being (without any body) existing in three “persons” (Father, Son, Spirit), exists outside of time and space as we understand it but is in all places and times, and that it is the human soul which is made in his image. Christ, being the second person of the trinity was born to a human body that we might understand the nature of God more fully and show us the path and help us to return to our intended nature to the glory of God.
Ok, wow. I’m just going to take these one at a time.
1. Catholicism employs human reason in explaining the concept of faith, while Orthodoxy doesn’t reconcile human reason with faith.
-This is like a half truth. We (Catholics) believe that faith and reason illuminate one another. They are like your left and right legs. Although you can hop around on just one if you like, utilizing both tends to work best. We hold that true faith and true reason do not need to be reconciled because they cannot contradict each other.
2. The Catholic doctrine evolves with change in time, and needs to fit in with prevailing circumstances, while Orthodoxy does not change it’s doctrine to fit with situational needs.
-This is just wrong, on both counts. Catholic doctrine grows with time as our understanding of Christ’s initial teachings improves. Examples of this can be seen as early as the First Council of Nicea (AD 325) when the term Homoousian was introduced to explain the relation of Christ to the father. Catholic doctrines may be further defined, but can never contradict that which came before. Since the Orthodox also accept the First Council of Nicea as authoritative, they are just as guilty of “changing” doctrine as we are.
3. In holy matrimony, for Catholics, divorce is not permitted under any circumstances, while for Orthodox, it may be permitted when adultery is committed.
-As far as i know this is true. But the explication given in the actual article is down right offensive. We refer to the sacrament of marriage as the ecclesial sacrament because we hold that it perfectly mirrors the union of Christ to His Church. In addition, a contract is what you have with a prostitute. What a married Catholic couple has is a covenant. A sacred, family bond. We don’t permit divorce because we do not have the authority to do so. The efficacy of the sacraments lies not with the priest, but rather in the Holy Spirit acting through the priest, thus only the Holy Spirit can dissolve the union which ensues.
4. Catholics believe that human reason can prove the existence of God, while the Orthodox believe that God’s knowledge is planted in human nature.
-Again, half truth. This is a both/and. We do believe that human reason can prove the existence of God, but we also believe a knowledge of God is planted in the human soul. These are not in contradiction.
So, if i were to apply what i know about my own faith and accept what this article says on Orthodoxy, i would have to conclude the difference is this;
Catholics uphold faith and reason as means to the truth.
Orthodox uphold only faith and reject reason.
As i know this is not the case, i would recommend the author of this piece learn about his own faith before he tries to critic mine!
If you look at the history of Christianity, you will see that the Orthodox church is affiliated with the Middle East, and was the original church. The biblical text stating that Peter was the man that began the church does not expressly stipulate that he was catholic as a result. If you visit the area where Jesus lived and died, you will find out that the Orthodox church is the one that is in charge of the Church of the Holy Sepulchre in Israel, where Jesus was said to be buried. The schism between the two churches occurred as a result of disagreement on both sides, so it was a matter of who left who. For many years, the papacy has attempted to reconcile the schism and try to reunite the two factions. Of all the sects of Christianity that have sprung up, these two are the most conservative in their dogma and teachings, so even though they may diagree, they are the most similar. I grew up in a house where one parent was one and the other was the other. Isn’t it odd that Christians cannot even agree on what they believe so how can we expect other religions to tolerate each other? I once had a Protestant ask me if I was Catholic or Christian?! If we can set aside the attitudes such as this, we might be able to agree to believe based on faith and unity of theology rather than divisive details. In the end, “God” has no denomination, and what we think we know is NOTHING. We are as insects, tiny and ignorant, we cannot begin to know or comprehend what God is or isn’t based on our meager intelligence and creating versions of what we think we know is foolish. Can we just agree that we believe in God and choose whatever way we instinctively feel is the right way for each of us? Orthodox means the right teaching and catholic means universal, so maybe one day someone can reunite the two and we can have the Orthodox Catholic Church or the Catholic Orthodox Church, otherwise we still have a myriad of cafeteria Christian sects to choose from, e.g., Baptist, Methodist, Lutheran, Episcopalion, Seventh Day Adventist, Evangelical, Presbyterian, etc. We cannot even agree one which Christian we want to be! Isn’t it a pity?
1. Orthodox Church’s is affiliated with the region doesn’t give its claims any more validity than another because the center of Church power shifted to Rome because that was where the center of corporal power was as well. Then the Orthodox Church broke off and occupied the area. Islam is also affiliated with that area, but you don’t mention their claims to validity at all. Geography means nothing after 2000 some years.
2. Of course the Papacy has tried to reconcile the ‘schism.’ That is the calling of all people: to spread the Good News of Christ to those who do not know or believe in Christ. Of course the Holy Father wants to bring the lost sheep back into the fold…
3. No it is not odd that imperfect humans have disagreements. Ignorance of the truth can lead to all sorts of problems because someone, somewhere didn’t know some basic religious principle and all their other resoning was based on that ignorance. The Protestant that asks if you’re Catholic or Christian doesn’t know that one incorporates the other.
4. Why did Jesus Christ come to Earth then, if he didn’t come to teach us? Why did God send Him if we’re too stupid to understand? By saying that we are too stupid to understand what Jesus taught us, you are saying that Jesus’ three years on Earth were wasted on us because His teachings were beyond our comprehension. Jesus didn’t need to experience humanity because it was new to Him but we needed him to become human so that we could understand Him. He is all-knowing; He wouldn’t have wasted that time if there was absolutely no point. You’re insulting God’s eternal wisdom by saying that He wasted 33 years for us.
5. Quite frankly, and I don’t mean to insult you, Milka, but your idea that we can all just live peacefully without religious conflict as long, as we worship in some way, sounds very Protestant to me. Many Protestants, especially Lutherans, are notorious for being difficult to convert because they believe that it doesn’t matter how we worship, as long as we believe, we are saved.
6. A pity, it is, that we can’t remember what the True Faith is even with all that the Roman Catholic Church does to remind the world. Peter’s current successor, Pope Francis, is working hard to keep all his children following the path of Christ, but some people simply won’t listen. If people would only use the logical processes that God gave every human as He intended, perhaps there would only be one Church. The main difference between humans and animals is the soul, free will, and deep logical processes. God created animals with all they need to survive, but created us with all we needed to survive and worship Him. Obviously a combination of His gifts, logic and faith, is required to live for Him the way he wants us to.
FILIOQUE? who started to change something that was explained by Jesus? (trinity)
catholics did…(schisma 1054)
that’s why they are considered to be (JUDAS) by true church…
catholics split..not the way around.
Orthodoxy was , is and will be. <- true church of ISUS HRISTOS.(remains unchanged for 2000 years since Jesus!)
catholics please learn history..
p.S. orthodoxy still upholds true teachings..(and we dont change something that was given by JESUS!)
———–
also catholics… stop playing a CLOWN, ask pope about were to find the true church… and know your catholic date of birth, 1054, it's the year when you started changing "understandings" the year of great schisma, the year when you decided to be different.repent!
I’m a Catholic & I’m certain that both the Catholic & Orthodox
are the One true church founded by Christ. They are both apostolic, one, holy and universal. Pope John Paul II has essentially said so and that their is NO theological impediments to reunification. The Filioque problem is due to translation of Greek vs Latin and both creeds are correct. Divorce, married clergy, faiths &
reason, ecumenical councils, Bishop of Rome & Antioch being the greater of equals, The Assumption & Immaculate Conception are not beliefs that both don’t already have similar views on & are comparable with the Bible and dogma. I believe the schism between catholic and orthodox will end soon. JF
Wouldn’t that be great James? If these two Churches would finally settle their few differences and reunite, it would be the first step, a huge step, toward global reunification of the people to Christ. I pray that you are correct and that human stubbornness does not hinder such a union as it would save many souls in the future.
The Catholic Church is such a shit with all its philosophical reasoning and garbage and shit!!!
Dear Pumpkinhead, All of Christianity is based on Wisdom. Without the great wisdom writers there would be no Old or New Testaments. The Talmud says the Sage is greater than than the Prophet. The sage is a wiseman. Jesus called the unwise a fool. In Greek, the, most common language of the Roman Empire when Jesus lived, the word wisdom is Sophia the etymology for Philosophy. Jesus, St. Paul, St. John ( the Word became Flesh )etc., etc., were all sages, wiseman, Philosophers. It was the early ancient philosophers who were the founders of the thought processes, logic, which has allowed us all to study and develop science. Yesterday’s Philosophers are today’s scientists. The Orthodox great Cathedral was St. Sophia. The Holy Spirit is referred to as Wisdom, ie. Philosophy. The term Pumpkinhead requires wisdom. Terms like: Incarnation, Trinity, Messiah, Sanctification, Sola Scripture, Sola Fides, Anointing, Mystery, etc., etc., could not be understood without wisdom. So even the Reformers and Reformed Faiths use Philosophy. So you & I both use philosophy everyday as we interpret our world around us. Catholic means universal so we all are in this together whether we like it or not. Jim Frost
I agree Jim. Without reasoning and conscious thought, we could not survive as a species. We humans are superior to animals because of these and other specific attributes given to us by God and without them, would be no better than them. If there is any reason the Catholic Church should abandon reason, I would like to hear it, especially if the speaker has somehow found a way to voice that reason without using reason or logic.
The article is full of misconceptions and outright fabrication concerning the Catholic Church.
The Catholic Church believes the precepts taught by Christ are unchangeable and has maintained every doctrine ever taught from Apostolic Times, whereas Orthodoxy has accepted the modern view of contraception, allows for divorce, and no single definite view on the sinlessness of Mary.
It is an outright fabrication to have stated “Catholic doctrine believes in the theory of doctrinal development, where the belief is that Christ’s teachings changes with the times.”
What the Church believes is that with further reflection and study more of the truth of the doctrine is revealed, but never changed.
For example, the Catholic position is that the sacrament of marriage is conferred by the baptized couple themselves with the Priest as Christ’ representative , recognizing the fact that marriages from prior to Jesus were blessed by and ordained by God. The Orthodox only view the priest as conferring the sacrament, which says what about the marriage of Saints Joachim and Anne?
To declare a dogma is not to introduce a new doctrine, but it is the Church’s stamp of approval given to a doctrine already believed from earliest times based on the teaching of the early Church Fathers and supported by scripture, to end the debate on the truth of the doctrine which it affirms.
As a Catholic I find this article outrageously misinformative and offensive.
Dear Louis Joy, Ditto, I concur & agree. Catholic Dogma is
rooted in Scripture and our 2000 years of traditional
teachings & can not & doesn’t change. Orthodoxy &
Catholicism have differences but our mutual Oneness & Holiness
( TRUTH & FIDELITY ) are greater. St. Pope John
Paul II desired & encourage unity saying there is no
impediment to re-unification. Only unnecessary rubrics, etc.
stand in the way! Matrimony is a True Sacrament in both Churches. The priest’s roll is a peripheral issue. Jesus Calls for Unity as does St. Paul in Scripture! We should unite and end this schism! Prayerfully, James/Jim Frost
I would also like to add that a few of your points are incorrect. As several commenters have noted, Catholic doctrine is actually not subject to change in any way. Doctrines may only be added (when a new theological discovery is made and validated by an official council or papal act), but never amended; addition very rarely happens, but when it does it is no different than the early church’s councils formed in order to settle theological controversy or heresy, or its writing of the creed, etc. If added, doctrines may never under any circumstance oppose a present doctrine. Also, the Catholic Church has never held that the existence of God can be proved scientifically. Reason is meant to aid faith and science can be extremely helpful in understanding doctrine because science is only an exploration of the world God created. However, it cannot be used to sufficiently prove the existence of God.
How do all you Catholics live with the monstrous anti semitism, pogroms, forced conversions, vatican crimes and financial power, the 4th crusade, the fascists in Croatia during the war? Doesn’t it bother you at all? Can you rationalize it away with a key of Peter. the Jewish fisherman?
I taught English to a Vietnamese priests some years ago…many came here after the war. He was full of horrible anti Jewish stories he said the jesuits taught.
There are many decent Catholic people, but “By their fruits you shall know them” has to apply to all of us…no pixie dust can cover it.
I am an Orthodox & Our difference with the Catholics is
1. when we were one united church , we believe that , the church of Antioch ,Alexandria & Rome are equal. One is not greater than the other .
2. The pope of vatican can not call himself the ruler of the christian world , just because his church is from the see of peter . The Siriyan church is from the see of john but it is equal in authority with the vatican . The Egyptian coptic & the Ethiopian orthodox churches are from the see of mark but they are not inferior to the vatican & can not accept the pope of rome as the universal ruler of the christian world .
3. All the christian churches in orthodox call themselves sister churches . One is not inferior to the other .
4. Orthodox christians lived peacefully with muslims even in the holy city jerusalem , but when the catholics entered jerusalem at the first crusade they killed orthodox christians when their fight was with the muslims .
5. On the question who got out of who , since the church of rome is only the see of peter and the orthodox churches keep the others , it is clear to know who got out of who . To make it simple , in a family of twelve if one got out , the one who got out is called the one who left the family . By the way, eastern Orthodox churches have much greater differences between them than they have with the catholic church , but they still call one another as a sister church . If the vatican is ready to act as a sister church rather than as a universal ruler of churches , we are ready to accept them.
6. Since both churches accept the seven secrets of christianity , we can unite as sister churches. The orthodox sister churches are equal in authority with the catholic church. The key to the gates of heaven given to peter does not place him above the eleven churh fathers . Peter represent the believers of christ in that dialogue because he answered Jesus’s question ” who do you call me ? ” . As an exanple you can take John , he was the only one present out of the twelve when Jesus was crossed , yet this doesn’t place him above his eleven church founding brothers . Jesus told them that they will sit on the twelve chairs to judge in the judgment day . He doesn’t place them one above the other .
7. I am an Ethiopian orthodox but we have many differences with the Greek orthodox than with catholics regarding church traditions , but we still are sister churches . So, why can’t the vatican accept to be a sister church , why can’t we be as united as the hardest early christian times .
Why don’t all Catholics just get on with practicing their faith. Seperate point – I’d also like to make a passing comment on eccumension liberal Catholicism. Indeed of which agrees with the subject of equality marriage. Indeed a branch of Catholicism.
Personally I find this interesting. Some may feel contradictory.
Helen, I am not 100% sure what you’re referencing when you say eccumension liberal catholicism, can you further explain?
That does not sound like a branch of anything but cultural-Marxism. The word of God makes it blatantly clear that homosexuality is an abomination.
Orthodoxy and Catholism should be same. The same church, the same pope. There should be no more difference between Ortodoxy and Catholism, no more. Christianity should be Christianity. And the gos of both Catholism and Ortodoxy is Jesus!!! So there should not exist the words Ortodoxy and Catholism. The church sould be same and the pope too!!!!
One note here. I’m a Baptist. I prayed to God for guidance and direction / “ask and you shall receive” – and he led me to them to be baptized. I’ve changed some of their fundamental beliefs as of arriving – no longer do they (at my church) condem all other religions. I have always said we’re all equal – no one person or one church is any better than any other – it’s a matter of accountability / after studying law for 20 years, I understood -> knowledge brings with it accountability, so the more knowledge, the more accountable you are to God – you may know more than others, but that doesn’t make you any better, just more accountable. Accountability in Law – is the obligation incurred as a matter of having obtained knowledge of any certain fact (that’s why they ask you in a court of law – “Do you have any knowledge of
… this or that…) / Thus knowing accountability brings with it an obligation, sometimes no knowledge will make you not guilty because no knowledge == no obligation ## which having thus ___ 1. Knowledge 2. Accountability “incurs” 3. Duty – if you “knowingly” / now have an obligation / it therefore becomes your “duty” to act in “accordance” or be guilty of not doing your duty and maybe even be guilty of treason – in some cases – punishable by death.
So what am I saying? I spent Christmas 2016 in a Catholic church communion in Las Cruces, New Mexico – I prayed to God when a friend asked me to go with him there / “ask and you shall receive” – He told me yes to go. It was one of the most holy experiences I’ve ever had. I asked God – “Should I” __ become a Catholic Lord?? He said – “No” / I’m still a Baptist and still changing them to this day. Is that why God put me there? We at the Baptist Church tend to criticize other denominations of Christianity – as I told them when I joined the church and they asked “What denomination are you” — my reply : “It doesn’t matter. I’m a Christian and that’s all that matters”
As one of my preachers put it –
“Not eveyone in Heaven is going to be a Baptist and not every Baptist is going to Heaven”
It’s not the church, the Bible says you take the temple with you wherever you go / church is where the heart is / where the body is, thither will the Eagles be gathered together. It’s the people that make the church and if // when we get to Heaven, there is no distinction between male and female — surly there will be only one religion — Christianity – I’m sure every denomination will be there – read the Bible : Paul says : “He who is without the law but does that which is within the law is a law unto himself” — I expect Cherokee Indians to be there siting on their palomino because they had reverence for the land no “white men” ever did — Did you know whenever they built a campfire, they would gather rocks from the river and put them back in “exactly” the same place as they got them from. That, my friend, is reverence for the land (our creation). Then my ancestors, “white men” came along and left the rocks laying all over America, went built another fire, left them again and again and again — and desecrated the land — and called themselves “holy” [get real]
Anyway first of all Catholic separated from the Orthodox CHURCH and Orthodox can actually trace back it’s roots to Peter . If anyone says that Orthodox rejected Catholic church it’s not true cause y’all even rejected Protestant so everyone should be equal cause the main thing is that you believe in God.Amen⛪☦️
I’m afraid “Unicorn” is mistaken as it is the Catholic Church who can follow the apostolic lineage directly back to Peter, whereas the Orthodox Church rejected the Papacy, that is Peter’s lineage. It was later on that Protestants left the Catholic Church, they weren’t rejected, the Catholic Church is just still waiting for the prodigal children to return.
Also, we’re all equal because we’re humans and all equally created by God. Humanity’s intrinsic value is not determined by what some believe. If that were the case, then you would also be saying that people who don’t believe in God aren’t equal with Catholics, Orthodox and Protestants. What about Jews and Muslims? Yahweh and Allah are the same being as the Father of Jesus, just seen differently. And what about pagans, atheists, etc? Are you condemning them?
“I’m afraid “Unicorn” is mistaken as it is the Catholic Church who can follow the apostolic lineage directly back to Peter, whereas the Orthodox Church rejected the Papacy, that is Peter’s lineage.”
1) No, the “apostolic lineage” doesn’t go just to Peter. It goes to Christ via ANY of the apostles and their various successors.
2) No, the Orthodox Church did not and does not reject the Papacy or Peter’s lineage. What the Orthodox Church rejects is the extreme Papal Supremacy notions that developed in the Latin Church over many centuries.
3) Many bishops trace their lineage to Peter, and rightly so. This includes bishops in the Orthodox Church, Anglican Church and others. The assumption that one of them magically rules the whole church and is infallible is a late historical fabrication and theological distortion. It is the Catholic Church which invented a doctrine/discipline here and attempted to impose it upon the rest of the Church. The rest of the Church simply said, “sorry, but we beg to differ.”
“The Orthodox Church separated from the Catholic Church, as did the Protestants in the 16th century. The very essence of the term Protestant means to be in protest against. Every denomination can not be equal because they all have to disagree on something, hence why there are over thirty thousand “Christian” denominations today. There can only be one true faith, which means all others are false.”
1) Who separated from whom is a matter of perspective. The Orthodox say precisely the same thing, that Rome separated from the One True Church.
2) The assumption that “my faith is the One True Faith” needs to be demonstrated — not simply asserted.
3) Claiming to be the One True Church and actually being it are two very different things. Most people do the former (ad nauseum) thinking they are doing the latter. Don’t be that guy.
The Orthodox Church separated from the Catholic Church, as did the Protestants in the 16th century. The very essence of the term Protestant means to be in protest against. Every denomination can not be equal because they all have to disagree on something, hence why there are over thirty thousand “Christian” denominations today. There can only be one true faith, which means all others are false.